Exactly! Target is crowded yes, but most people don’t shop sitting shoulder to shoulder, maskless with people outside their household. I went to Sawtelle a few weeks ago and it looked just as packed as the before times and people were hanging out in groups outside of places waiting, blocking sidewalks thinking just because they were with their frenz, they could wear their masks as chin straps or just half way.
It’s sad… but most of the fury should be directed at those who are leaving the affected workers without a safetynet when local governments have to make these tough decisions.
Agreed. Sitting maskless and 3’ across from someone at a restaurant table is simply inherently risky.
Wearing a mask at a Target, or even being maskless but well distanced in a backyard while having a drink with a friend, pale in comparison. It sucks, and additional relief funds for restaurant owners are desperately needed, but when case rates are tripling and hospitalizations are growing by more than 60% in one week’s time, it has to be done.
In addition to the other things people have said, I think the other thing is that people don’t really linger at stores unless they’re forced to b/c of the line, they’re not sitting in one place for extended periods at stores, and they’re generally not going to stores in large groups. Plus, I don’t usually touch my eyes, nose, or mouth right after I touch something at a store (b/c I’m wearing a mask).
If restaurants were only serving parties-of-one w/ distancing and people wearing masks unless they were eating, that probably wouldn’t be a big deal. What I’ve seen at some restaurants, though, are large-ish groups of people w/ their masks off (even when there’s no food), talking very loudly. I assume one could be spraying a whole bunch of stuff w/o meaning to, in that situation.
We’ve a restaurant in our area that’s returned to having live music: can hear the cheers and all else blocks away, and when walking by it’s large groups, maskless, drinking and singing along, yet the city hasn’t stopped it.
As someone who has been takeout-only since March, there are definitely some best practices I’ve seen (plastic/glass partitions, tables far apart, etc) that I would prefer be mandated rather than banning altogether. It would be also nice if the slightest care had been paid to the needs of small businesses dependent on in-person customers (rent forgiveness, grants, loans, etc). Obviously most of this is on the feds, but still.
It’s ironic, the people who resist the masks, social distancing, and shout against shutdowns and restrictions are the primary cause for spread and the primary reason these businesses are suffering. They cause that which they decry.
Like the toilet paper hoarders who cleaned out the shelves and then a day later said “see, there’s no toilet paper, good thing I got mine.”
So many great comments. I think the problem, to a large extent, stems from a lack of enforcement. In West Hollywood individuals can be fined for not wearing masks, yet it doesn’t appear the mandate is enforced. I’ve seen more and more people on the street not wearing masks. Nor are the occupancy limitations enforced. While some restaurants - All’Acqua and Casita de Campo come to mind - take the mandate seriously, others (in West Hollywood in particular) don’t.
The toilet paper shortage was exacerbated by hoarding, but its primarily cause was a sudden increase in demand for the consumer-type product due to people using the toilets at home instead of work. There was a corresponding surplus of industrial-size rolls like you see in public restrooms.
The only confirmed cases of outdoor transmission I’ve read about involved people sitting close together, without masks, and talking for a while. So I’m not sure there’s a significant risk in eating outdoors at restaurants so long as the tables are not close together, the only people at your table members of your household, and everyone wears masks except when seated. On the other hand, I’m not so certain that it’s safe that I’ve done it myself.
The problem is that people who are dining or drinking together at restaurants and bars probably don’t live together. People are having maskless parties without social distancing in their backyards. I have seen friends maskless at restaurants with other friends on my IG feed. I know they don’t live together. There are also plenty of Trump supporting Covid non-believers out there.
Exactly this. I would bet most people dining outdoors these last few months dine with friends or family that are outside their household, and there’s absolutely no way of enforcing that.
Thank you so much for posting this @JeetKuneBao! You’re giving folks the real and I hope all members and lurkers read it. Sooo happy you’re recovering and I wish you much improved health now and for the remainder of this horrible time we’re in. Big elbow bump to you!
This is where it all falls apart. If there were any way to mandate AND enforce that, I’d bet outdoor dining would still be open. Then again, I’d also bet there would only be a small fraction of people choosing to dine out, if they were only allowed to do it with their household (the same household they’ve been locked up with since March ).
Yes, but what are the socio-cultural issues contributing to that (not that I think we should mention them here b/c that would be REALLY off topic)? I mean, public-health officials and elected officials are getting death threats, so I don’t blame restaurants for not being super anal about enforcement w/ customers.
@jlee the restaurants are being unfairly being blamed-- not because of what they are doing, but what patrons are doing. as @anneexploresla mention, its the social interactions at restaurants…people that post supposed negative tests on IG then go out and party with friends. People don’t understand incubation time and false negatives and of course, the Trump deniers.
One restaurant we dined out at, Phenakite, has explicit instructions that you must be in the same pod/household. But of course this is honor system. we feel horrible for restaurants, first responders, hospital workers. nurses, doctors…
Yes and no - as everywhere there are restaurants who comply to the rules but also some who (partly) ignore them (particular around density numbers). Here in Boston for example some Italian restaurant in North End made it early on quite clear that they don’t want any rules (and I have read about similar stories everywhere in the US). One of the main issues is the missing financial support for independent restaurants through the government which would make it easier fir them to close down for some time especially during high Covid numbers. (At least in California outdoor dining is possible for most of the year, here on the east coast the restaurant are really screwed with winter starting (and many are now closing or hibernating)
).